Episode 44: Saving Taxes and Accelerating Your Investments with The Smith Maneuver  

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Join us in this episode as we dive into the intricacies of The Smith Maneuver, a powerful financial strategy that can help you grow your wealth while efficiently managing your mortgage. We break down the key concepts, strategies, and potential benefits of implementing The Smith Maneuver, and provide real-world examples to help you understand its application. Whether you’re a seasoned investor or just starting on your financial journey, this episode offers valuable insights into how you can make your mortgage work for you.

What you’ll learn:

  • What is The Smith Maneuver and how does it work?
  • The tax advantages and wealth-building potential of this strategy.
  • Practical steps to implement The Smith Maneuver.
  • Real-life success stories and common pitfalls to avoid.
  • Expert tips and guidance for financial planning and investment.

Resources:

Interested in Joint Venture Opportunities?

For those interested in being considered for potential Joint Venture (JV) opportunities, reach out to us here.

Contact Matt if you’re Buying or Selling Real Estate in Windsor or Essex County!

Reach out to Jon if you’re looking for an Ontario Mortgage, Ontario Mortgage Refinance or a HELOC in Ontario.

Get in touch with Kyle to begin your journey through his Canadian Wealth Planning System.

Check out the work Jon and Kyle do assisting mathematics educators and district leaders.

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R00:00:00:04 – 00:00:25:23
Kyle Pearce
Most big banks have this. I currently have one in my home. I believe you both have a variation of a re advanced mortgage as well. And the beauty there is that if you were able to find, say, I’m going to use $10,000 as a nice number, if I could take $10,000, let’s say you got a bonus from work or let’s say you sold a car or let’s say you sold an investment, maybe you have a GC sitting there with $10,000.

00:00:26:07 – 00:00:53:00
Kyle Pearce
What you could do is instead of just investing that $10,000 in the GIC over here earning say right now you can potentially earn four or 5% with interest rates the way they are. But before you do that, you take the 10,000, you put it down on your mortgage, and then all of a sudden your home equity line grows by 10,000 and you borrow the 10,000 to then go reinvest in the AC.

00:01:04:24 – 00:01:10:13
Kyle Pearce
Welcome to the Investing Teacher podcast with Kyle Pearce, Matt Biggley and Jon Orr.

00:01:10:13 – 00:01:19:08
Jon Orr
Get ready to be taught as we share our successes and failures encountered during our real life lessons. Learning how to build generational wealth from the ground up.

00:01:20:04 – 00:01:25:00
Matt Biggley
Welcome to Investors Students to another episode of the Canadian Wealth Secrets podcast.

00:01:25:11 – 00:01:46:14
Kyle Pearce
All right there, friends, We are going to be digging in today and we’re going to be talking all about how we can turn our mortgage, our primary residence mortgage into a tax write off. Now, that’s obviously yeah, that’s the interest. Now, if you’re American and you’re listening to this show, you might be saying like, wait a second, what do you mean?

00:01:46:24 – 00:02:14:16
Kyle Pearce
Isn’t your mortgage a tax write off? And in the U.S., you can write off the interest on your primary residence mortgage. But here in Canada, you can not. So once again, Canadians are suffering the high, high tax sort of bandits of the government, the Canadian government. But today, we’re going to talk about some of the ways that you can do this and one such way you may have heard about it before.

00:02:14:16 – 00:02:44:09
Kyle Pearce
It’s called the Smith Maneuver was by Frazier Smith. He was the creator of this move. And ultimately, it’s totally legal. It’s totally above board, and it’s compliant with the CRA and the tax code and all of those details. So there’s no issues there. But the real key is making sure ultimately at the end of the day is that as Canadians, we need any expenses that we’re paying in order for them to be a tax write off.

00:02:44:16 – 00:02:49:13
Kyle Pearce
You need them to go into sort of a business of some type. So that could.

00:02:49:13 – 00:02:51:14
Jon Orr
Be income making money to make income.

00:02:51:14 – 00:03:09:24
Kyle Pearce
You got to make income with it, right? So a primary residence does not generate income. Matt, you’ve talked about it before, where our primary residence is not supposed to be looked at as an investment, although a lot of people do view it that way. It is an asset. Yes, indeed. But there are massive expenses that go along with it.

00:03:09:24 – 00:03:37:00
Kyle Pearce
So with our high taxes that we pay on income here in Canada and in all the provinces, it varies from province to province. We need to be looking at ways that we can minimize our tax burden. And looking at your own primary mortgage is one such way that we can sort of accelerate that. So we’re going to talk about a couple of those strategies, including some of the moves that the Smith maneuver.

00:03:37:00 – 00:03:52:20
Kyle Pearce
You see what I just did there, what they’ll offer you in order to do some tax savings. But before we get going, I want to flip it to Matt, because you and I were using a form of the Smith maneuver in our early investing journey.

00:03:52:22 – 00:03:55:23
Matt Biggley
It’s just what great investors and I don’t know what it’s like.

00:03:56:11 – 00:04:09:16
Jon Orr
I don’t know what it is. You’re already jumping in saying you’re going to say, Hey, we did this already. But I feel like I don’t even know what this is. Listeners right in are like, I don’t know what it is yet either, but they’re going to start telling me benefits. Why don’t you outline what it is, because…

00:04:09:16 – 00:04:10:17
Matt Biggley
Right now it sounds more like a Wrestling move than a financial strategy!

00:04:10:20 – 00:04:18:01
Jon Orr
You’re saying is my mortgage and all of a sudden I have to start generating income with it? Tell me more. Give me an insight here.

00:04:18:02 – 00:04:44:07
Kyle Pearce
Absolutely. And Matt, why don’t we start with how we were using a strategy that ultimately does the same thing. Now, the Smith maneuver is sort of a way in order to transform form your mortgage interest on your primary residence into something that can be written off so that you can get a tax deduction. Let’s look at an example of what that might look like and sound like for real estate investing.

00:04:44:13 – 00:04:56:11
Kyle Pearce
Matt, take us back down memory lane. How were you and I investing in our first North Shore property investment when we came together back in 2016?

00:04:56:14 – 00:05:20:00
Matt Biggley
Well, this is one of the hard parts about investing. It’s like you need to come up with a chunk of dough. And if you’re just trying to save week to week, month to month, that is literally going to take you forever. So in our case, we turned to what was at that time and remains one of the best sources of large chunks of dough, to use the technical term, which was our home equity lines of credit.

00:05:20:00 – 00:05:45:08
Matt Biggley
So lines of credit that were secured against our homes based on the equity that we had baked into our houses already. So it was easy to qualify for. We’d already qualified for them. There was money sitting there waiting to be used. And to this day we’ve always been big proponents of getting lines of credit, including secured and unsecured helix, just to have them just have some money that’s parked there.

00:05:45:21 – 00:06:01:14
Matt Biggley
Maybe you never, ever use it, maybe you do use it. So even when I got my mortgage in my most recent house, sorry I didn’t get a mortgage on my most recent, I still went and said, I want to get a lock on this house so that I have that money to invest should we need to. So that’s how we went about it.

00:06:01:18 – 00:06:21:18
Jon Orr
What you’re saying is because that’s what we did when we partnered together and we bought our house in comma, we use the he locked money from my hillock to buy that property. So are you guys saying that this is what the Smith Maneuver is? It’s like we’ve taken a chunk of money from our he lock, which is the debt equity on our home which is kind of accessing that equity.

00:06:21:18 – 00:06:42:07
Jon Orr
That’s where you’re paying down your mortgage. And now all of a sudden, because that money is now investment money over here and we’re making income off that investment. Are you saying it’s like now I get to claim part of my mortgage payment or is it the interest I get to claim or both?

00:06:42:20 – 00:07:07:00
Kyle Pearce
Yeah, and I would argue the Smith maneuver kind of takes it and it talks about essentially transforming some of the money you owe on your home into this tax free or tax refundable interest that you’re going to be spending. So, yes, ultimately what you did, John, and what Matt and I did, we had this home equity line, which has to be a separate account from your mortgage.

00:07:07:08 – 00:07:27:16
Kyle Pearce
So that’s one key thing. In the Smith maneuver, they talk about it if you read the book or if you dig in, they have some courses. That is a trademarked strategy. So Frazier’s Smith and there’s a foundation Smith maneuver dot com. You can read all about the different maneuver or the different ways you can go about this. So we had done one possible strategy G there.

00:07:27:16 – 00:07:53:06
Kyle Pearce
And really the goal is that you again have this separate account. It’s still connected to your home, so it’s still secured by your home, but now that account is a investing account. It’s like an account that you’re going to use in order to generate income. Like you had said earlier there, John. Now, how the Smith maneuver, sort of how they unpack it, they actually look at it in a slightly different way.

00:07:53:06 – 00:08:13:23
Kyle Pearce
And the way they look at it is they say, listen, if you could take say, $10,000, they like re advanced LBL mortgages. So a re advanced double mortgage is one where there’s the traditional mortgage and there’s a home equity line on it. But the home equity line continues to get bigger as your mortgage is paid down. Most big banks have this.

00:08:13:23 – 00:08:37:20
Kyle Pearce
I currently have one on my home. I believe you both have a variation of a re advanced home mortgage as well. And the beauty there is that if you were able to fine say I’m going to use $10,000 as a nice number, if I could take $10,000, let’s say you got a bonus from work or let’s say you sold a car or let’s say you sold an investment, maybe you have a GIC sitting there with $10,000.

00:08:38:04 – 00:09:04:13
Kyle Pearce
What you could do is instead of just investing that $10,000 in the GIC I see over here earning say right now you can potentially earn four or 5% with interest rates the way they are. But before you do that, you take the 10,000, you put it down on your mortgage and then all of a sudden your home equity line grows by 10,000 and you borrow the 10,000 to then go reinvest in the GIC.

00:09:04:13 – 00:09:32:17
Kyle Pearce
See, now we can layer this even further in a second, but I want to break this down for a second in terms of what’s actually happening, because your mortgage now goes down by 10,000, but your home equity line goes up by 10,000. Okay, So you paid down 10,000 on your mortgage. Now your home equity line opens more access to 10,000 new dollars and you’ll now borrow that 10,000 to put in this GIC.

00:09:32:24 – 00:10:05:10
Kyle Pearce
Now, if you look at your debt, your debt is the same. But all of a sudden now that $10,000, the interest on the $10,000 is now a tax deduction. So not the entire mortgage. Right? So if it’s a $200,000 mortgage now, it’s $190,000 mortgage. And I have a $10,000 hole in my home equity line. Now, I can write off the interest on that $10,000, which is more money in your bank.

00:10:05:19 – 00:10:29:04
Kyle Pearce
And you still can go and buy the GIC over here.

00:13:44:03 – 00:14:13:14
Kyle Pearce
So the maneuver is all about taking ways where you can recycle the money. And basically what you’re trying to do is any opportunity. The way the Smith maneuver suggests it is that you want to take the money and you want to put it on your mortgage first, to open up room in your home equity line so that you can then borrow from there and make the interest tax deductible while your mortgage amount, the amount owing will ultimately stay the same.

00:14:13:14 – 00:14:36:13
Kyle Pearce
Now they talk about all these acceleration strategies as well, where you could then on the investment, take the proceeds of the investment and use that to start paying down your mortgage again. But ultimately it’s just this snowball that they want to try to transform as much of your primary home, your primary residence mortgage interest into tax deductible interest.

00:14:37:02 – 00:15:18:16
Kyle Pearce
That’s sort of the process. And the goal is to try to snowball that as best you can. Now, we’re not huge fans of RRSPs personally because we like purchasing real estate, but ultimately the same thought process is taking place when you borrow on a home equity line of credit to, say, purchase an investment property. Now that interest is tax deductible interest and ultimately at the end of the day, we want to owe as little interest on our primary residence attached to our primary residence with a traditional mortgage as possible and owe as much mortgage on the home equity line, if at all possible.

00:15:18:21 – 00:15:47:13
Kyle Pearce
Assuming that you are taking that money and putting it into an investment that’s going to at least achieve what you’re paying in interest on that home equity line of credit. Now, if that’s not the case, then you might want to start second guessing what it is you’re investing in. And maybe you don’t necessarily want to put it into a see, that was an example, but you’d probably want to be putting it into something that’s going to give you a better return than say, something pretty low, like a GIC or a mortgage, for example.

00:15:47:16 – 00:16:04:14
Matt Biggley
Now, this comes back to the topic that’s been a thread throughout all of our episodes. Is this good debt idea, this good debt. So that’s what you’re talking about there, Kyle, and having people rethink debt. And you’re right, there’s so many ways that Americans can benefit from the tax code that Canadians can’t or don’t. That’s a rabbit hole will get done.

00:16:04:14 – 00:16:34:04
Matt Biggley
But the key to this is, I guess is really finding a good read. That’s a mortgage product. So, John, I wonder from your experience in the mortgage world, I’ve dealt with credit unions on my last couple of mortgages and they have a really clumsy product for re advance of a mortgage. And there’s the Manulife one. I’ve heard from clients that it sounds really great, and in practice I had a client who had a really challenging time with Manulife, so I wonder, is there a product that you know about or can recommend?

00:16:34:04 – 00:16:56:23
Matt Biggley
Because that’s really the key to all of this. If you have that perfect dollar for dollar exchange between the hillock and the mortgage, and that is a beautiful thing. You can watch that really fluidly. In my case, we had to reapply every time we wanted to access more money for the heat lock, which was totally clumsy and full of bureaucracy, and it was a far from frictionless experience.

00:16:56:23 – 00:17:12:11
Matt Biggley
So in my head, when I picture those dollars moving back and forth, albums have this mental image and it gets me really excited. And then I didn’t experience that. So yeah, What kind of a product did you get seen out there? You know something? I’m not that we’re endorsing anything here in particular, but from experience, what have you seen out there that.

00:17:12:12 – 00:17:18:14
Jon Orr
Matt, were you saying when you wanted to access your he like money you had to apply? It wasn’t like just a bank account. No.

00:17:18:14 – 00:17:49:23
Matt Biggley
Well, so when we wanted to if we had paid down a chunk of our mortgage and we wanted to and we wanted to access more, he lost money that we had to go back through. It was a lesson tense procedure than the full application, but it was still enough that it was there was some friction there. And I think the goal here, when this is really fluid to absolutely beautiful thing, and that’s what the Manulife one was supposed to suppose, that it would be that fluid dollar for dollar between the mortgage and the he and I just wonder what other products might be out there from your experience you’ve heard.

00:17:49:23 – 00:18:08:24
Jon Orr
Yeah, I think there’s lots that are seamless. It’ll depend what lender a client wants to go with, but that seamless kind of fluctuate option is there. So at something that you’re listening and you want to explore, we’d be glad to hop on a call and kind of see where where you’re at and what your situation looks and find that product for you.

00:18:08:24 – 00:18:28:11
Jon Orr
So, Matt, there is those out there that are a lot more seamless than what you’ve described, but depending on say there’s in our database here on our mortgage side of things, we’ve got access to 40 plus lenders that have umpteen products that we can dive into and look and see what is the right move for you to have both of those things.

00:18:28:20 – 00:18:38:17
Jon Orr
Actually, a lot of them have great discounts. If you go with that double product, you lock plus your regular mortgage and creating that can actually get you a better rate as well.

00:18:38:23 – 00:19:06:08
Kyle Pearce
And I also want to go back as well. So essentially, every lender nowadays has some form of it. Like you had said, Matt, different lenders might have I like the word clumsy, as you had mentioned, some might have more of a smooth process, some might not. A lot of the bigger banks, a lot of these primary lenders that are out there, even lenders that aren’t, say the big banks, but the MCAPs of the world and some of these other lenders that a mortgage broker might lean on more so than, say, the traditional banks.

00:19:06:18 – 00:19:29:01
Kyle Pearce
They have these products that you can see both accounts online and it’s almost instantaneously when you make an extra payment where you see that extra funds open up inside of the home equity line. So that’s really awesome. And I also just want to go back to because I don’t want anyone to get stuck on, say, a home equity line having a higher interest rate than, say, a fixed mortgage.

00:19:29:01 – 00:19:51:00
Kyle Pearce
Now you might find that to be a bit of a challenge right now. If let’s say you’re on a fixed mortgage like I am, I have a fixed mortgage on my fixed portion and it’s locked in at a low rate. But my home equity line is floating like a home equity line does float. So it’s prime usually prime plus a half, sometimes prime plus one, depending.

00:19:51:00 – 00:20:10:23
Kyle Pearce
Some people get prime even if they have a really good relationship, whatever that might be. So right now you might have actually a big gap between the amount you’d be paying in fixed interest if, let’s say you were locked in at 2% and now your home equity line is say 7% or seven and a half percent, that’s a big jump.

00:20:11:07 – 00:20:35:19
Kyle Pearce
However, you should still do the math on that, because if let’s say it’s $100,000 that we’re dealing with at the end of a year, 2% is $2,000. Okay, I got you. And now we’re not assuming any compounding or anything like that. So just keeping it simple, $2,000 7% would be $7,000. So you still have to do some math there and go, okay, that gap might be too wide in that particular scenario.

00:20:35:19 – 00:20:55:20
Kyle Pearce
If your fixed is really low and your home equity is high, but you should still do the calculation because if you’re in a 50% tax bracket, you go, okay, well, what am I saving when I write that off? I’m writing off 30 $500 of the 7000. Right? So you write off 7000 off of your income, it’s going to save you 30 $500.

00:20:56:01 – 00:21:20:23
Kyle Pearce
You’re still technically behind. However, what did you do with the money, though? If you took the money and then invested it, you might still be ahead. So you should still do the math on it. If there’s a gap, If it’s a big gap, then it might be harder. But if let’s say you’re looking at you have a fixed rate of, say, 4% and your home equity line is 7%, that might still make sense depending on your tax bracket.

00:21:21:07 – 00:21:42:02
Kyle Pearce
And keeping in mind as well that eventually what’s going to happen is like my low fixed rate, it’s going to go away soon, Right? Like here in Canada, typically people lock in most commonly for five years. You can lock in longer, but usually you have to go at a higher rate to do so. Right. Because it’s a longer time period and there’s more unknowns.

00:21:42:10 – 00:22:05:22
Kyle Pearce
But if you have a year left on your fixed interest rate, then in a year purifying anyway, right. Or you’re renewing anyway at a higher interest rate. So that gap might only be a temporary gap. Maybe you hold off until you do that refinance or that renewal and then you still end up wanting to do the same thing anyway because at the end of the day, the interest rate is going to be going up.

00:22:05:22 – 00:22:26:24
Kyle Pearce
So just keep those things in mind and don’t say no to an idea until you fully explore to to see, Hey, does this actually make sense and will this actually allow me to compound and snowball this effect so that I’m not only saving my tax, but I’m also opening up our opportunities to make better investments and compound the investments as well.

00:22:27:04 – 00:22:49:24
Jon Orr
Cal, why do you think more people don’t know about this? What’s been holding people back? You’re making it a case that if you’ve got is it because maybe people don’t have this extra money to put down? I think people are making regular deposits into investment accounts or investments outside of their RRSPs. So I’m curious, is it just education?

00:22:49:24 – 00:22:56:19
Jon Orr
And the idea hasn’t spread or is it there are some downsides to this. And a lot of people say like, hey, maybe we don’t go this route.

00:22:57:07 – 00:23:20:20
Kyle Pearce
You know what? I think everything you said, I think it’s a bit of all of those things. So I think yes, education’s key, thinking about how on educated we are in financial literacy, we are not financially literate as a society and that’s a massive problem. Finances really scare a lot of people, right? So when they start talking about it, they start talking about budgets, they worry about whether they’re saving enough.

00:23:20:20 – 00:23:40:02
Kyle Pearce
It’s a lot easier for people to avoid it. And then you also have to think about it does introduce complexity and that is scary to a lot of people, right? So I’m the type of person being the fact finder that I am. I love going down those rabbit holes. I love exploring them, I love understanding them and trying to grapple with these ideas.

00:23:40:10 – 00:24:00:09
Kyle Pearce
But for a lot of people, that’s kind of a scary thought. It’s a scary thing. People don’t want to do things wrong. And then I’m going to also argue that there’s a lot of people out there they’re supposed to be acting in the best interest of their clients, but they don’t necessarily have a deep enough education or understanding themselves to be able to do so.

00:24:00:09 – 00:24:33:15
Kyle Pearce
So I’m talking about I’m kind of calling out a lot of financial advisors that are out there that really their main goal is just helping to make a commission off of, say, investing in some sort of fund, a mutual fund or whatever the product is that the bank is sharing. There’s really no benefit. For example, if I work at a big bank and I’m the financial advisor guy, there’s really no advantage for me to spend time helping you or Matt or anyone else out there to try to take money from here, to pay it off on there and borrow over here.

00:24:33:21 – 00:25:03:00
Kyle Pearce
It doesn’t change my life as a financial advisor, but it does change your life as a customer. So for me it seems like a logical strategy, but ultimately that’s not what they’re paid to do when they’re sitting behind the big bank desk. They’re there to sell you the products from the bank. They’ve got the mortgage. They want you to have a home equity line of credit, but they’re not really interested necessarily in trying to help you strategize how you might be able to save more income taxes.

00:25:03:10 – 00:25:23:13
Kyle Pearce
Although some who are forward thinking enough would see that, Well, actually, if I open up more income for you, then you’d be able to then reinvest it. And then in turn, my bottom line would be helped out as well. So there’s a lot of pieces there. Education and then is there a want or a will or some sort of benefit for them?

00:25:23:23 – 00:25:28:22
Kyle Pearce
And I think the strategy sometimes gets a little scary for some people to even think about.

00:25:29:07 – 00:25:52:17
Jon Orr
Yeah. And I think it brings up that mindset idea about borrowing money. We talked about that when we talked about dividend paying whole life insurance to use on the bank, on yourself or the infinite banking concept to use to invest and make more money. So it kind of double dipping seems like a similar type of thing that people get hung up on the idea of borrowing your own money.

00:25:52:21 – 00:26:11:22
Jon Orr
It’s like, Oh wait, I could put the money on my mortgage. I could put the money just in straight into an investment account or I could put it on my mortgage, but then borrow it back to invest. Now, right that whole I’m borrowing my own money. I have cash right here and now I have to put it here, which helps my mortgage.

00:26:11:22 – 00:26:37:22
Jon Orr
But now I have to borrow it back and pay interest on that. Right? It’s like, wait, that’s more interest. Even though we’ve kind of articulated here that it’s possible that the whole point is to win out in the end anyway. So it’s like that whole mentality of trying to understand that you’re paying interest regardless, right? It’s like either I’m giving up the possibility of earning more interest or saving more on tax in this case versus earning that investment or paying interest.

00:26:37:22 – 00:26:56:00
Jon Orr
Somebody is paying interest somewhere. You’re losing on the possibility of gaining interest when you put it over here or you’re paying interest when you borrow it. That interest is on every dollar out there in our economy. It’s just who’s paying it and whether you’re earning it or whether you’re paying it, it’s there regardless attached to your dollar.

00:26:56:05 – 00:27:19:20
Kyle Pearce
Yeah, I think you highlighted something that’s a really important mindset shift, especially in this particular case. Legitimately. If you take let’s say you save $200 a month and you put it into some investment, you put it in tax free savings, you put an RRSP wherever you choose to put it, or you just put it in a savings account because you’re just trying to save thinking about this, it’s like people still struggle with that idea.

00:27:19:20 – 00:27:45:18
Kyle Pearce
If I took $200 to pay off my mortgage and then borrowed the $200 from the line of credit, literally the same debt is over there. But in their mind, they think they’re borrowing the money. But in reality, it’s like you’re not borrowing the money. You took this 200, you already borrowed that money. It’s already all over there. All we’re doing is like putting it in this store so that we can take it out of that door and literally the balance stays the same over there.

00:27:45:24 – 00:28:11:17
Kyle Pearce
And then I can go and invest this over here and get a tax deduction there. There’s nothing as clear cut and dry. But yet that idea, even though rationally people can say, yep, I get it, I understand it. To get that mindset and get over that mindset is a really big leap. And the same thing happens when we talk about infinite banking or bank on yourself or any of these whole life strategies that we’ve discussed in the past.

00:28:12:03 – 00:28:35:01
Kyle Pearce
That’s a really tough part too, because people can take the $200 a month and put it over here or they can put it into a policy, grow the policy and they can borrow back from it and still do another investment. Now you have two investments over here, but one of them you have this hole that’s there and in their minds they’re going like, now I had to borrow my own money to do it.

00:28:35:01 – 00:28:54:00
Kyle Pearce
And it’s like, No, you got to investments out of it. And that’s a very, very hard, hard thing for people to overcome. But those people and again, we always call out people listening to this show to people that are listening to a show like this are the people that are going to take these strategies and they’re going to go, you know what?

00:28:54:13 – 00:29:34:10
Kyle Pearce
I can use this to get ahead. And that’s why so few people get ahead and so many people feel like they’re left behind is because you just got to put that little extra bit of thinking in there, that little bit of mindset shifting and really just going and doing what you know is going to help you in the long run, which is building your net assets or your net worth so that you have more assets growing and compounding while your interest over here, you’re getting more tax deductible interest instead of just paying off interest every year, every month like we normally do with our primary residence.

00:29:34:14 – 00:29:55:08
Matt Biggley
I wonder for you guys, I guess, is can you hire an advisor to help you do this? I wonder if part of the reason people don’t do this more is because it’s not a product. It’s pushed by banks or financial advisors or I mean, there’s lots of spots here. We’re recording this at almost 8 p.m.. This is more like an 8 a.m. kind of a topic for me.

00:29:55:08 – 00:29:57:24
Matt Biggley
You know, feeling a little sharper.

00:29:57:24 – 00:29:58:23
Jon Orr
Going to bed after this.

00:29:58:23 – 00:30:21:03
Matt Biggley
Mat Yeah, yeah. It’s still full of Thanksgiving dinner from yesterday. So yeah, I definitely get the slips. But my wonder is, can you hire someone to help you with this? Or because there’s so many little spots that you can get stuck here in terms of laying this out? Yes, you can read the book, but I’m going to say the most of us are capable of reading a book and then implementing at a high level, like we need more help than that.

00:30:21:03 – 00:30:41:23
Matt Biggley
And you can’t walk into your local big bank and be like, teach me how to do this math. Maneuver. Like, who can it be? Are there people out there you can hire to do this? What’s the best way to actually feel competent in it before you try it for yourself And as John talked about earlier, fear messing up tax wise and then all of a sudden getting the CRA for Canadians, we’re kind of wusses.

00:30:41:23 – 00:30:45:18
Matt Biggley
But that’s pretty scary for most of us to have to be on the wrong side of the Sierra.

00:30:45:23 – 00:31:11:06
Kyle Pearce
Yeah, totally. And actually there are in particular. So for the Smith Maneuver, they do have a certification program. I’ve actually been sniffing around. I know it really, really well. But I’m like, you know, just to have that certification is something that I’ll probably find myself doing. Finding someone who knows about these strategies is there are people out there who know them being finding creative people that might be your tax advisor, right?

00:31:11:06 – 00:31:31:14
Kyle Pearce
Or it might be your accountant. Some accountants are just essentially not exactly there to help you get creative with your thinking. So find people who can help you with that. Hey, they want to reach out to us over at Canadian Wealth Secrets dot com. Of course we love hopping on calls with people. You’ll see a call button there. You can book a call with us.

00:31:31:20 – 00:31:52:15
Kyle Pearce
We hop on calls. We love meeting people. We love growing our network and we try to help point people in the right direction. There’s so many different strategies out there. I love all the strategies we discuss here, but the reality is, is that different strategies make sense for different people at different points in their life. So I think that’s another big thing too.

00:31:52:15 – 00:32:13:24
Kyle Pearce
It’s not about necessarily going while the Smith Maneuver is the thing I got to do, it’s just knowing what are my options? Finding someone who knows the landscape well enough to be able to guide you and point you in the right direction. That, I think, is one of the best things you can possibly do. You could go and you could search for someone who is, let’s say, Smith maneuver certified, right?

00:32:14:07 – 00:32:34:22
Kyle Pearce
But that might be all they got. Right. And that could be great, but they might not be seeing other areas of your life that maybe you aren’t paying attention to. Right. That other aspects that you’re not paying attention to. So I would say looking at people who have a wider lens, who have experience in all of these various areas so that you can get focus.

00:32:34:22 – 00:32:55:20
Kyle Pearce
One thing we’ve noticed with a lot of the calls we’ve had, we’ve invested students who have reached out to us is that they have all these ideas, but they’re not sure where to start, right? So finding someone who has experience in a wide variety of these areas, again, the Canadian Wealth Secrets team here, we have quite a bit of experience in various strategies.

00:32:56:01 – 00:33:20:11
Kyle Pearce
We’ve implemented many different ones and we modify the strategy based on where we are at the time and in the current economy or the macroeconomic sort of landscape. So reaching out to us, let’s get on a call. And of course, if we need to point you in a direction, we’ve got quite the Rolodex of all kinds of great people out there that we can point you towards so that you can get the help that you need to take the next step.

00:33:20:16 – 00:33:26:22
Kyle Pearce
That’s going to be critical in you getting to your own personal financial freedom journey down the road.

00:33:27:07 – 00:33:48:18
Jon Orr
Awesome, awesome stuff. So I’m thinking about the Smith maneuver. We outlined what it is. We gave a few examples of how to apply it. We talked about some benefits, we talked about some drawbacks and things to think about, some things to think, whether it’s for me, whether it’s not for me. And we even just outlined where to go to get more information and to get help on implementing that and any other strategies.

00:33:48:18 – 00:33:54:03
Jon Orr
So, Kyle, any last thoughts you want to leave with the audience on this idea before we wrap things up?

00:33:54:09 – 00:34:12:02
Kyle Pearce
Hey, all I say is make sure that you’re looking at your finances, thinking of ways that you can win, right? Because No. One, the government’s not going to come and tell you how to win. Nobody else is going to come and tell you how to win. Find ways that you can help when you’re spending money every single day.

00:34:12:07 – 00:34:29:22
Kyle Pearce
Let’s try to put more money back in our pockets. Let’s be smart about where that money is going and how we’re deploying it. And hey, maybe the Smith maneuver is the right thing for you at this time, or maybe it’s not. But look into it so that you have it in your back pocket when it is the time for you.

00:34:30:02 – 00:34:51:17
Matt Biggley
It’s awesome. I think so much of what we talk about on this show is about thinking differently about wealth, and a lot of this stuff is unconventional, but it takes an unconventional approach to wealth building to truly get wealthy because we know the conventional route. We’ve lived it as teachers. That is going to make you fine, but it’s not ultimately going to make you wealthy.

00:34:51:17 – 00:35:10:06
Matt Biggley
And this is about wealth building. And so this is one of many, many different strategies we’ve talked about in the show. And what’s so great is the variety of them. Obviously, different ones are going to appeal to different people. So think differently about wealth, think unconventionally and dive deeper into any one of these strategies in the Smith Maneuver.

00:35:10:09 – 00:35:16:09
Matt Biggley
When I’m on coffee tomorrow morning, I’m going to revisit this episode so I can dig a little deeper myself.

00:35:16:18 – 00:35:40:14
Jon Orr
Awesome. Awesome. Hey, we want to thank you. The one that’s listening right now or listening to us talk about this topic. And if you’ve listened before, then we want to thank you for coming back and listening again. If this is your first time, we do want to welcome you. And once you listen to a few episodes, we want to encourage you to leave a five star rating and review on the podcast platform that you are listening right now, sharing that podcast with friends and family.

00:35:40:23 – 00:35:53:07
Jon Orr
It helps spread the word, spread the word about financial literacy that we’re trying to convey, just like those messages that you guys just shared. So does that favor it, that rating review and share with your friends and family? We would very much.

00:35:53:07 – 00:35:53:21
Kyle Pearce
Appreciate.

00:35:54:03 – 00:36:07:09
Matt Biggley
All links, resources and transcripts from this episode can be found over on the website that’s investor teacher dot com forward slash episode 44. Again that is invest in teacher dot com forward slash episode 44.

00:36:07:19 – 00:36:30:24
Kyle Pearce
And as always head over to invest in teacher dot com and hit that call button hop on a discovery call tell us a little bit more about yourself where you’re at and we’ll do our best to point you in the right direction as to getting you to that next step in your wealth building journey. All right. Invested students class dismissed.

00:36:44:22 – 00:36:58:11
Kyle Pearce
Just a reminder, this content is for informational purposes. You should not construe any such information or other material as legal tax, investment, financial or other advice.

00:36:58:21 – 00:37:18:05
Jon Orr
Hey, just as a reminder, Matt Begley is a licensed realtor in the province of Ontario with your book Realty. John That’s me. John or is a mortgage agent with Brick’s mortgage license. m23006803 And Kyle Pierce is a licensed life and accident sickness insurance agent with corporate advisors and pan financial team.

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