Episode 52: Looking at Mutual Funds Under the Microscope

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In this episode of the podcast, Jon Orr and Kyle Pearce dig into the pros and cons of investing in managed mutual funds versus their benchmark index funds. Despite the common messaging in the media surrounding the high management fees and the inability for any managed fund to consistently beat the market from year to year, we look to unpack some of the potential benefits that managed mutual funds might provide for those seeking a more hands-off approach. 

In order to dig in more deeply, we share some sample analysis of the performance of a few managed mutual funds over a decade and get more specific as to what the media could be saying when they claim that mutual funds don’t consistently beat the performance of their benchmark index.

As you’ll learn in this episode, some managed funds do outperform their benchmark indexes over longer periods of time and therefore push back on the claim that one should always consider index funds over managed mutual funds for their retirement, education, or other investment savings accounts. 

Which route should you go? Let’s take a dive into actively managed mutual funds vs. benchmark index funds and determine what might be the best fit for you based on your specific goals and investor profile. 

What you’ll learn:

  • What are managed mutual funds and benchmark index funds? 
  • Are benchmark index funds always the better option than a managed mutual fund?
  • Should I be ditching my “big bank” managed mutual fund? 
  • Does a mutual fund with a high Management Expense Ratio (MER) always matter? 
  • What really matters when it comes to passive investing in the stock and bond market?



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Get in touch with Kyle to begin your journey through his Canadian Wealth Planning System.

Check out the work Jon and Kyle do assisting mathematics educators and district leaders.

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00:00:00:06 – 00:00:20:19
Kyle Pearce
When you’re dealing with index funds. The reality is, is that it’s likely that it’s going to be more work on you to actually figure out which index fund do you want and how do you actually go about purchasing it. Right. So that’s one barrier right there. And I know for some people they’re going to come on, you just open up an investment account like it’s not that hard to do.

00:00:21:00 – 00:01:01:18
Kyle Pearce
It almost seems this is as easy as getting an email address, like a free Gmail address. Right. That’s how simple it seems. But for some people, that might be enough to hold them back from actually investing. So there is that part that I think we should recognize is that everyone is different and nothing is. I don’t think we should be blanketing anyone to do a certain thing or not to do a certain thing because it actually might have that thing that they need in order to take action.

00:01:01:20 – 00:01:08:04
Kyle Pearce
Welcome to the Investing Teacher podcast with Kyle Pearce and Jon Orr.

00:01:08:04 – 00:01:18:06
Jon Orr
Get ready to be shot as we share our successes and failures encountered during our real life lessons. Learning how to build generational wealth from the ground up.

00:01:18:12 – 00:01:41:09
Kyle Pearce
Welcome invested students to another episode of the Canadian Wealth Secrets podcast. Now, my friends, we are excited to dive in. You may have noticed something in the intro. You heard only two names on the way in. Matt is just so bogged down, which is a good thing. It’s definitely a good thing. But he has graciously decided to sort of opt out on the regular.

00:01:41:09 – 00:02:00:24
Kyle Pearce
But I have a funny feeling we’re going to be bringing him in for some check in updates. Maybe we’ll even call them interviews whenever he’s available to hop in on the podcast and also for those who are listening, we’re actually in the middle of a bit of a rebrand right now. We are putting our thinking out there. Yes, absolutely.

00:02:00:24 – 00:02:24:24
Kyle Pearce
We are looking at trying to become more specific for the type of people that you are. You friends who are listening are looking to go from whatever your income is, be at a high or middle income level to creating high net worth. And over this next little while, we’re going to be shifting away from the Canadian Wealth Secrets branding.

00:02:25:01 – 00:02:47:22
Kyle Pearce
So just giving you a heads up for that. If you have ideas, let us know on social media. You can tag us right now at Canadian Wealth Secrets anywhere, but also leave us a rating and review on your favorite podcast platform. And maybe that review could be what you think we should be calling this podcast. That would be a fantastic way to give us some feedback.

00:02:47:22 – 00:02:56:04
Kyle Pearce
But before we go any deeper here, John, what is it today that we’re going to be diving into with our listeners?

00:02:56:06 – 00:03:20:01
Jon Orr
Well, we often want to talk about common issues, common decisions that we have to make in our financial lives, in our planning for financial futures, but also managing our current portfolios. And I think this is something and I read the book from Retreat, Sweetie, I will teach you to be rich. He often talks about in that book that you should get all of your money out of the mutual funds.

00:03:20:01 – 00:03:40:21
Jon Orr
And that was a shocker for me because I think on this podcast I’m on record of saying my dad was all about getting his pension. But I mean, when we picked our yes piece. So education funds for my kids are recipes for my wife. Where went the mutual fund route? That was the way to go get it in a mutual fund.

00:03:41:02 – 00:04:05:20
Jon Orr
You don’t really have to do any thinking. We picked like a balanced portfolio as a fund and it was like, that’s you let it grow. It’s about time in the market, get it in there. And when I read, I will teach you to be rich. The thinking was like, Well, you shouldn’t be there because you’re paying fees to that manager and if you put in, say, an index fund, an index fund is a low cost index fund.

00:04:05:23 – 00:04:25:13
Jon Orr
Those are that particular index fund or index funds will beat mutual funds every single time. So why are you putting your money in a mutual fund? You need to get it out of there and get it into index fund. So I remember thinking that all those years ago when I read that book and going, Yeah, he’s right. I need to get it out of there and get him into the index funds.

00:04:25:15 – 00:04:48:19
Jon Orr
So in this episode we want to talk about like, should we have done that all those years ago? Is index fund the right move for putting some of our portfolio money in those, or should we stick with mutual funds or is there a balance between them? And that’s what we want to kind of talk about today, maybe do a little bit of debunking of myths and talking about like that kind of mindset to go Is index funds the way to go?

00:04:48:21 – 00:04:56:22
Kyle Pearce
Yeah, it’s interesting because I and I think on the podcast as well, we’ve sort of done our fair bit of ribbing on mutual funds and.

00:04:57:03 – 00:04:57:11
Jon Orr
I think we.

00:04:57:11 – 00:05:15:13
Kyle Pearce
Have it’s a general thought and a lot of investment sort of advisors, Wealth advisors are in the same camp, at least those who don’t sell mutual funds will put it that way, right? Those who do sell mutual funds that make a commission off of it, of course, they’re obviously not going to be saying a whole lot about it.

00:05:15:13 – 00:05:38:17
Kyle Pearce
But let’s really zoom out a little bit, because in previous episodes we’ve talked about things about like defining your personal beliefs, right? Looking to what is it that you’re hoping to achieve. We’ve talked about what kind of investor are you really? And we’ve also talked about even how a lot of people tend to have their financial plan or their investment plan sort of backwards.

00:05:38:19 – 00:05:58:05
Kyle Pearce
And sometimes people get really excited about a thing and then they sort of go all in on that thing. And for some of these people, they might not be ready to do that type of work. Right? So really, I think what this comes down to is it’s really getting to know yourself and trying to figure out what is best for you.

00:05:58:05 – 00:06:18:18
Kyle Pearce
One thing I’m going to give it to in mutual funds is if you are the type of person listening to this podcast, you’re probably not that person that’s sort of looking to just sit back and just let it happen. But for those who aren’t listening to this podcast, I’m going to say that a mutual fund might make sense for them because it’s super easy to do.

00:06:18:18 – 00:06:37:19
Kyle Pearce
And I would say if you’re going to do something and you can get that barrier to entry down, so if it means calling your bank person or just doing a quick pop into the bank and saying, Hey, listen, I want to start putting in $500 a month into this or into that or whatever that is way better than doing nothing at all.

00:06:37:21 – 00:07:00:05
Kyle Pearce
And I’m going to tell you this much when you’re dealing with index funds, the reality is, is that it’s likely that it’s going to be more work on you to actually figure out which index fund do you want and how do you actually go about purchasing it. Right. So that’s one barrier right there. And I know for some people they’re going to come on, you just open up an investment account like it’s not that hard to do.

00:07:00:10 – 00:07:29:08
Kyle Pearce
It almost seems this is as easy as getting an email address, like a free Gmail address. Right. That’s how simple it seems. But for some people, that might be enough to hold them back from actually investing. So there is that part that I think we should recognize is that everyone is different and nothing is. I don’t think we should be blanketing anyone to do a certain thing or not to do a certain thing because it actually might have that thing that they need in order to take action.

00:07:29:10 – 00:07:54:07
Kyle Pearce
So I want to start the conversation there, but I also want to dig deeper into where this claim comes from about mutual funds. You sort of generically said at John that mutual funds will always lose to the index, and that’s maybe a little bit too blanket. It’s not that it will always, but they do say that mutual funds will not consistently beat the market.

00:07:54:07 – 00:08:24:15
Kyle Pearce
So what they’re saying by that, typically and if you research this and you look this up and we’ll put a couple articles in the show notes here that you can go off and read a little more about this. Typically, when you look at this massive basket of mutual funds, typically they don’t consistently beat the market in some research, even say like, you know, just to do two in a row where like the mutual fund, the managed mutual fund actually beats the market two years in a row is like very, very low odds.

00:08:24:15 – 00:08:52:20
Kyle Pearce
We’re talking like 1 to 3% or something of the mutual funds to do that consistently. So over the long term, obviously that’s not happening. However, two things that I want to dig into is that what market or what index are we talking about? Right? So when they say that mutual funds in general don’t beat the index, are we talking about all the mutual funds that exist out there compared to all of their indexes or indices, as we would say?

00:08:52:20 – 00:09:17:09
Kyle Pearce
Because keep in mind, there’s the S&P 500. There’s an index for all 500 of those stocks. Are we just talking about S&P 500? Are we talking about the TSX in Canada? Are we talking about an emerging markets mutual fund and comparing that to a index? Right. So every mutual fund has an index that it’s benchmarked against is what they call it.

00:09:17:09 – 00:09:36:09
Kyle Pearce
So there’s like a benchmark there. And if you look them up online, they actually are on many sites. One that we’re going to share today is Morningstar Dot S.A. This is a Canadian site. However, I’m sure there’s all kinds of different ones in different parts of the world if you’re listening somewhere else. But for our Canadian friends, Morningstar, our dossier actually will break down.

00:09:36:09 – 00:10:01:13
Kyle Pearce
It’ll let you look up all of the different mutual funds that are out there. And then in the table you can actually see the returns of that particular mutual fund after the fees have been removed. So this isn’t like you have to subtract anything or do any math. It’s like, here’s what the return was and it also shows you here’s what the return of the benchmark index that this fund is trying to beat over time.

00:10:01:17 – 00:10:26:10
Kyle Pearce
So you can quickly look at this stuff and you can kind of figure it out for yourself. And what I find is that when it’s an S&P sort of mutual fund, that one’s a hard one to beat because basically what you’re trying to do is you’re trying to like just knock out any of the losers in the 500 businesses, but like 500 businesses, those are like the 500 largest businesses in the United States and in the U.S. stock market in the S&P 500.

00:10:26:10 – 00:10:59:22
Kyle Pearce
That is. So if you’re trying to knock off the losers, that to me feels harder than, let’s say, looking at a bigger index, say an emerging global market sort of fund where you can maybe identify pretty quickly which businesses have a good model and which ones don’t. So it’ll be really interesting here for us to dig in. But one thing that I do want people to consider is that just because a mutual fund doesn’t consistently beat the index, does it always mean that the index is the better option for you?

00:10:59:22 – 00:11:05:11
Kyle Pearce
And is it always the case? Right. And I think we’re going to dig into that conversation a little bit more here today.

00:11:05:13 – 00:11:24:16
Jon Orr
Well, that’s what I was wondering if you said if I take the time and look at mutual funds instead of just doing the easy case. Now, the easy case can be for me because I don’t want to think about it or I just want my money to grow, but I don’t want to actually have to take all the time necessary to dig in and figure all these things out.

00:11:24:16 – 00:11:47:09
Jon Orr
I’ve got other things I want to do with my time. And so that’s a case for why you might just go, Hey, let someone else manage this. I am going to make money on this, but I don’t have to say get that extra 2%. To me, that’s the case for a mutual fund. But then when you say there’s only two years, if it beats the market in two years, and then that’s rare.

00:11:47:11 – 00:12:08:08
Jon Orr
And I could have just put that same money in an index fund by opening, say, an online trading account and buying shares of that index fund. And that money can grow at that point. It’s kind of like, well, why would I want to go with the mutual fund if I know that I can get the better return here versus here?

00:12:08:08 – 00:12:28:24
Jon Orr
And I guess my insight right now, Kyle, is that the only benefit I’m seeing right now is that time aspect that go, look, we read the book who not how for many different reasons. And I’ve actually read it twice and it’s from Dan Sullivan and Ben Hardy, and that book talks about it. It was more of a business book.

00:12:28:24 – 00:12:47:13
Jon Orr
When you’re running your own business, you want to ask the question like, who should do this task and not how to do this task? Because oftentimes a task will come up in business and you’ll go like, how do I get that done? Or what’s the process to complete that? Or how do I bring that into my business? Or how do I tackle that social media aspect to my business?

00:12:47:15 – 00:13:12:13
Jon Orr
And in the premise of the whole book is about stop asking how to get a task done or how to do this. Ask who should get that done because that will free you up. I’d say the business owner spending time on building out your business and building on your business versus working in your business. And so it’s like get someone else to kind of figure that part out or take responsible for that component of your business.

00:13:12:13 – 00:13:42:13
Jon Orr
So that’s what comes to mind right now. If you’re like Kyle, Kyle, you said like John, you should do options trading because we did that for a while. You should do options trading because it’s a no brainer. There’s a safe way to do this. But then it’s like, but that’s going to take time out of my day. And if I’m going, okay, so does that mean I go down this route Now I have to schedule a block of time in my day to complete those transactions, or maybe it’s a block every week or it’s a block every month.

00:13:42:13 – 00:14:04:22
Jon Orr
But right now that triggers in my brain. Is that a me task or is that a who task? Do I get someone else to do that? Because I don’t necessarily need to do that and where should my time be spent otherwise? A lot of these kind of choices that we have in life. I now run through that filter of going like, Can I get someone else to do this?

00:14:05:02 – 00:14:22:08
Jon Orr
And if I can’t, should I do this now? Because it is my time best spent doing that activity? It might be it might be to go down that route and learn about that or take control of that. Now, I maybe just because I want to write it, just because I’m like, I’m excited to go down that new pathway.

00:14:22:10 – 00:14:43:12
Jon Orr
So. Or is it like, should I just pass it off because I’m not really excited to go down that pathway at this time. I can pass it off. I can get someone else to manage that piece. So when we talk index funds versus mutual funds right now, you know, the the lean towards a mutual fund is great because it’s like I can pass it off.

00:14:43:14 – 00:15:05:09
Jon Orr
And I know that that task is going to be taken care of. And I can go over here and build my business and I don’t have to think about how to manage my money over here. I got someone who’s managing that mutual fund. So right now, Kyle, the trade off for me, right, is, is that extra fee that you’re paying the mutual fund worth it to you versus the extra fee, the extra money you’re going to make on the index fund?

00:15:05:09 – 00:15:15:17
Jon Orr
So like, that’s the trade off right now. Let’s say it’s an extra 2% you would have made each year. Is that worth it dollar amount for you to not do that work?

00:15:15:19 – 00:15:36:03
Kyle Pearce
Right. And I would say as well, like so great points here and I think this is so important, so true for so many people, because even when you’re doing this, what sort of joy does it bring you? Does it bring you any joy? Are you driven to do this work? And like you said, it’s like for a lot of people that don’t have they’re not willing to even look into what an index fund is.

00:15:36:03 – 00:16:06:10
Kyle Pearce
For some people, they’re like, I don’t know what the definition of an index fund is. So for that person, it’s like there is now a barrier to entry for them to even make this comparison. So maybe just go to your bank in the meantime, You know what I mean? Like, Hey, go do that. Or someone you trust, like a trusted wealth planner or wealth advisor doing that, whatever it is that you need to do, the key is doing the work and then if you’re willing to do that work by getting some money in there, then if you want to go down the rabbit hole and you think that you want to make some changes, then

00:16:06:10 – 00:16:23:00
Kyle Pearce
definitely go for it for example, if you read the book that you had cited by Amit Sethi, is is if you read that book, then you’ve already done a lot of work, right? You’ve already done a lot more work than a lot of people have done. So following that advice to go index funds and set it and forget it, probably not a bad move.

00:16:23:01 – 00:16:39:05
Kyle Pearce
You’re not going to go wrong because the index is the index. However, for some people that are looking for those boosts, it could make sense. So we’re not here to try to tell you one way, one thing or the other. And I think that’s the part that people want. They just want you to tell them what to do.

00:16:39:07 – 00:16:59:10
Kyle Pearce
But I guess what we’re saying is that like, do what you think makes sense. So what I want to share with you friends is actually an article this is on Morningstar, and they actually highlighted Canada’s top three mutual funds of the decade. So we’re talking like the last ten years in Canada. Which ones were the best actively managed funds?

00:16:59:10 – 00:17:30:19
Kyle Pearce
So it was like, let’s take a look and let’s see what these are. Now. They are not just straight up like S&P or like U.S. broad market funds. One that came in first was Manulife’s Global Small Cap Fund. Now, right off the top, when you think about small cap, we’re talking about smaller companies, which means more volatility. So if we’re talking about this fund, you should be comparing it to, say, a balanced or a conservative mutual fund that say your local bank is providing you right.

00:17:30:19 – 00:17:55:08
Kyle Pearce
Like you have to compare apples to apples. So when we look at this particular fund, over ten years, they had a annualized ten year return of 16.16%. Now, a lot of people are like, that’s pretty good. But once again, what did the index do? So if I go and I look at this fund up here on Morningstar and I look this thing up, I’ve got it shared on the screen for those who are watching on YouTube, for those who are listening, you can check it out later.

00:17:55:10 – 00:18:18:00
Kyle Pearce
This particular fund has an MMR. This is your management fee of 1.23%. All right. So 1.2, 3% is taken off the top and goes to manage the fund. It goes to pay for those expenses, but your returns are net of that number. So it’s like it kind of to me, when I look at returns, I’m like, I don’t care.

00:18:18:00 – 00:18:48:07
Kyle Pearce
You could be taken 20% off the top. That’s what hedge funds do, right? Hedge funds take a big chunk off the top and you still get supposedly get a good return on the other end. So I don’t actually care about the MSR as much as I do about the actual performance. So if I look at this and I look at just the table, you can see that the fund return back in 2013, 40% compared to the index of 35%, then it’s 12% to 13%.

00:18:48:07 – 00:19:11:06
Kyle Pearce
Ooh. So it lost that year right there. It just broke the trend. Right? It proved the fact that it doesn’t consistently win. But look at the next year, 32% to 18%. That’s a big win, right? Like that’s a big win. Even though we didn’t do it consistently, this fund crushed the index that year. The next year it lost just it almost broke even by 0.1%.

00:19:11:06 – 00:19:41:04
Kyle Pearce
It lost. The index got 7%. You’re like, ooh, that’s a big spread. So again, no consistency there. Then it got 22% compared to 15. So it won. Then it’s lost to the index, lost four. So it won again two in a row, 25% to 19%. It won again 15 to 13, one again, 5 to 15. It lost broke the streak, -17 to -11, lost again, two in a row.

00:19:41:06 – 00:20:19:21
Kyle Pearce
And then we can look at here to date this year it’s beating the index. So for this particular fund looks pretty good. And depending on where you start this journey, right, it might paint a different picture. But something I want to share is if you did start by chance to invest in 2013, like this ten year run is looking, you can see on this chart here that this particular mutual fund is crushing the index by or I should say crushing it was crushing the index for the most of the time, likely because of that first year bump that it had it at that 40% bump compared to 35%.

00:20:19:23 – 00:20:46:02
Kyle Pearce
And then it had enough up years where it stayed ahead, stayed ahead, stayed ahead, and then still ahead in 2023. But if you change the time horizon, if you start on like, let’s say a down year, where it’s losing, what’s that going to look like? That’s going to change things. So I could change this. So now that we’ve got this interactive chart up here, you can actually see this curve is going to look differently if you start at ten years versus if you start at five years.

00:20:46:02 – 00:21:09:12
Kyle Pearce
Right. And you see some down years there in three years, it’s like, oh, doesn’t look that great. But ultimately at the end of the day, if you are considering a mutual fund and if you do want to do this comparison, you might be able to find funds, mutual funds, actively managed mutual funds that give you enough upside on the win years that even if it doesn’t consistently win, it might still make sense.

00:21:09:12 – 00:21:30:09
Kyle Pearce
So the reason I’m sharing this is not to create confusion. If you want simplicity, the easy answer is just put it into the index and then you don’t have to worry about someone picking right or picking wrong. It’s just the index does what it does. But if you don’t have that ambition, you’re not even concerned about it. Just putting it into a mutual fund doesn’t make you a bad person.

00:21:30:09 – 00:21:47:14
Kyle Pearce
Is really, I think, the big takeaway that I want to share and this is true with many other mutual funds as well. So if you are in a mutual fund right now, what I would recommend you do this is like a next step for you. If you’re curious, maybe you’re in a really crappy mutual fund and you should get out of it.

00:21:47:16 – 00:22:18:22
Kyle Pearce
If that’s the case, do it right, but make sure you know what you’re doing. Like, imagine if you were in one of these funds that actually is doing really well and then you blindly follow the advice to get everything out and put it in the index when you’re actually winning more years than you’re losing. And those winning years are significant enough that it actually makes a massive difference in the end return that you get at the end of five, ten, 15, who knows how many years, then you’re just kind of blindly following and you’re actually hurting yourself more than you’re helping.

00:22:18:24 – 00:22:44:15
Kyle Pearce
I think in general you’re probably going to find that the mutual funds you’re in probably isn’t one of the better ones, right like that. In general, you’re probably going to find that. But I guess the point is the big takeaway that I’m hoping people will get from this message today is that don’t just write off mutual funds without actually looking into whether you’re in a good one, in a okay one or in a nothing or in a really, really bad one.

00:22:44:15 – 00:23:05:04
Kyle Pearce
Right. Like, even if you’re in one that’s just like kind of hovering along with the index. I don’t know, maybe it’s not worth your time to actually do the withdrawal and pull it out. And who knows, maybe tax consequences, right? So be smart about it. Don’t just blindly follow advice. Take that advice and then think about it and go, Does that actually apply to me?

00:23:05:04 – 00:23:26:10
Kyle Pearce
Or what do they really mean when they say that? No mutual fund. There is not one out there that consistently beats the market right there. You’re like, Oh, then I’m going to go for the index. But what if every other year it does and it does buy more than double? I think I like that a lot. So you really just want to look into this, make sure that whatever decision you’re making, it makes sense for you.

00:23:26:10 – 00:23:49:21
Kyle Pearce
And I want to go back to what you said, John, is that every decision we make, it has to be based on your own situation. So if you want set and forget, maybe you’re already in a set and forget, maybe that’s fine. If you’re like us, like we’re kind of like more fact finders and we’re more interested. But I’ll be honest, I’ve spent thousands of hours diving down all of these different rabbit holes because I love learning about it.

00:23:49:23 – 00:24:12:24
Kyle Pearce
But I’ll be honest, more and more I come back to how can I do this consistently without having any sort of risk? Any sort of risk is maybe extreme, but I want to just know what’s going to happen more predictably into the future instead of me just sort of trying to find the home run thing that’s going to take us to this next place, when in reality so many of those home run balls end up getting caught at the wall.

00:24:13:01 – 00:24:37:18
Kyle Pearce
You just want to make sure that whatever it is that you’re doing, it matches your goals, your personality, your financial profile and investor profile. And of course, we on the team would love to be a part of that journey for you. So, hey, if you need somebody to chat with, maybe you’re not sure what you should be doing or what you should be considering, reach out to us over at Canadian Wealth Secrets dot com forward slash discuss free overtime.

00:24:37:18 – 00:24:55:14
Kyle Pearce
You might see that that link may change but we’ll make sure to redirect if it does so head over to Canadian Wealth Secrets dot com forward slash discovery and hop on a call with us and let’s chat it out. Let’s see where you’re at and whether you’ve got the right pieces in place. Maybe it’s just the advice might be just continue doing what you’re doing.

00:24:55:14 – 00:25:06:07
Kyle Pearce
You’ve got a great thing going and maybe you might want to adjust something. Who knows? But get on that phone call and feel confident about the work that you’re doing to invest for your financial future.

00:25:06:09 – 00:25:26:24
Jon Orr
Hey, we want to thank you for listening to this episode of the Invest Teacher podcast. Don’t forget, it would mean the world to us if you hit that subscribe button, if you haven’t already, but also leave us that review and rating. So we hit that review and rating button. Go ahead and take a minute here and type in an honest rating and review of the podcast.

00:25:26:24 – 00:25:45:04
Jon Orr
It does help grow the podcast so that we can help reach our goals, which is helping as many people understand their financial wealth and their wealth creation pathway. So head on over to the review button, hit that and we look forward to reading it.

00:25:45:06 – 00:26:05:08
Kyle Pearce
Friends. All Shownotes resources transcripts and the opportunity to book a call is over on the Canadian Wealth Secrets Ecom website. Once again that is Canadian Wealth Secrets AECOM. And today we’re dealing with episode five two so Canadian Wealth Secrets dot com forward slash Episode 50.

00:26:05:10 – 00:26:32:07
Jon Orr
Two All right, Investors, students class dismissed just as a reminder of the content you heard here today is for informational purposes only, you should not construe any such information or other materials legal tax, investment, financial or other advice.

00:26:32:11 – 00:26:52:23
Kyle Pearce
John Or is a mortgage agent with the B.R. X Mortgage Group License number m23006803. Kyle Pierce is a licensed life and accident and sickness insurance agent with the PAN core team and does wealth planning with corporate advisors and the PAN financial work group.

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